<div dir="ltr">All,<div><br></div><div>Based on my experience in the distant past with disembodied refrigerator compressors used as vacuum pumps</div><div>There are two likely candidates --</div><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 40px;border:none;padding:0px"><div>one fixable -- get a replacement capacitor for a handful of $</div></blockquote><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 40px;border:none;padding:0px"><div>the other the compressor is unable to accelerate due to dirt or some other internal failure -- only fixable by a pro with a new compressor and new refrigerant -- probably a junker</div><div><br></div></blockquote>My money is on the capacitor as they eventually all fail<div><br></div><div>Ted</div><div><br></div><div>PS: the coils being really dirty might make the compressor run longer -- but unlikely to make it draw more current</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 4:39 PM John P. Rudy via LCTG <<a href="mailto:lctg@lists.toku.us">lctg@lists.toku.us</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div class="msg6629134695332933399"><div lang="EN-US" style="overflow-wrap: break-word;"><div class="m_6629134695332933399WordSection1"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext">Thanks for all the details.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext">I do know to switch the switch to off before moving to on<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext">It has now been on for 7 hours<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext">Having the filthy coils would have made the refrig work harder and they are now cleaned<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext">John<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:windowtext"><u></u> <u></u></span></p><div><div style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:windowtext"> Ken Pogran <<a href="mailto:pogran@alum.mit.edu" target="_blank">pogran@alum.mit.edu</a>> <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 26, 2024 4:32 PM<br><b>To:</b> John P. Rudy <<a href="mailto:jjrudy1@comcast.net" target="_blank">jjrudy1@comcast.net</a>><br><b>Cc:</b> 'Steve Isenberg' <<a href="mailto:smisenberg@gmail.com" target="_blank">smisenberg@gmail.com</a>>; 'Lex Computer Group' <<a href="mailto:lctg@lists.toku.us" target="_blank">lctg@lists.toku.us</a>><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lex Computer & Tech Group/LCTG] refrig<u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">John,<br><br>My guess is that the problem is with the refrigerator compressor motor or its supporting components. Motors such as these draw far more than the usual current as they start; once they are at running speed, the current draw decreases to normal. (It's why your lights might dim a little bit when your central A/C kicks on, for example.) <br><br>Also, some motors are "capacitor-start", using a capacitor to give the motor an extra "kick." There's usually a centrifugal switch that takes the capacitor out of the circuit once the motor is up to speed.<br><br>If a motor never gets up to speed, it will continue to draw too much current and overload the circuit; eventually the breaker will trip (how fast depends on the degree of overload; it's not like a fuse that blows instantly). <br><br>The motor might not get up to speed because<u></u><u></u></p><ul type="disc"><li class="MsoNormal">The capacitor has gone bad (open or shorted)<u></u><u></u></li><li class="MsoNormal">The motor winding has failed in some way<u></u><u></u></li><li class="MsoNormal">The motor shaft has seized due to failure of bearing lubrication (my Mech. E. dad explained to me that so-called "oilite" bearings—made of sintered bronze—are impregnated with oil under pressure at manufacture. They last a long time with no attention but eventually lose their lubrication, resulting in great friction. He had his own trick for extending the life of a motor by <i>temporarily</i> re-lubing such a bearing. Even a ball bearing will eventually fail as the grease it is initially lubricated with eventually dries out.)<u></u><u></u></li><li class="MsoNormal">The refrigerator's compressor, driven by the motor, has seized, probably for similar reasons.<u></u><u></u></li></ul><p>Or, if the centrifugal switch fails, the motor might be running at full speed but the capacitor may still be in the circuit, continuing to draw excessive current.<u></u><u></u></p><p>Ken Pogran<u></u><u></u></p><p>P.S. I trust you know that to reset a tripped breaker, you first move it to the OFF position and then to the ON position. <u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal">John P. Rudy via LCTG wrote on 8/26/24 11:14 AM:<br><br><u></u><u></u></p><blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt"><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">The extra refrig (with a freezer compartment) is in the garage and both it and the separate freezer go to the same outlet box.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">3 days ago the refrig stopped being cold but the light was on so there was power. I didn’t look at the breaker then.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">I removed everything from the refrig/freezer and set the dial from6 to 9 and left for the weekend. When I returned last night everything was cold.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">This morning it was warm and the light was off. One breaker was in the middle and I tried to reset it to the left but it wouldn’t hold. I connected the refrig to another circuit and then returned to the breaker and this time it did reset. I returned to the refrig and cleaned the coils. I haven’t pulled it out to try to find the fan. Then the refrig stopped again.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">I returned to the circuit breaker and was able to reset it. That worked for 20 minutes and then it flipped. I reset it again and all has been fine for a half hour. I’ll check it again in an hour</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">No water and no damage to the cord.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">The first time the refrig stopped and the light was on the separate freezer was working. When the breaker flipped, both stopped (of course)</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">It is an aged Amana refrig</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><div style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in"><p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Steve Isenberg <a href="mailto:smisenberg@gmail.com" target="_blank"><smisenberg@gmail.com></a> <br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 26, 2024 10:56 AM<br><b>To:</b> John P. Rudy <a href="mailto:jjrudy1@comcast.net" target="_blank"><jjrudy1@comcast.net></a><br><b>Cc:</b> Lex Computer Group <a href="mailto:lctg@lists.toku.us" target="_blank"><lctg@lists.toku.us></a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Lex Computer & Tech Group/LCTG] refrig</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">1. What changed between (when it was working and not tripping the circuit breaker) and (now when circuit breaker trips)?<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)">2. Does the breaker trip as soon as you plug in the refrigerator or reset the circuit breaker?</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">3. Has it been exposed to water (e.g., flooded basement)?<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">4. Could the power cord be damaged? (rodents might chew on it)<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">For #1 I'm wondering if you moved it to a new spot or plugged something else in on the same circuit, and then the problem started.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">For #2 if it happens immediately when you plug it in or reset the breaker, this would make me think there might be a short in the refrigerator (which leads to #1, when did this start?)<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Trebuchet MS",sans-serif;color:rgb(11,83,148)"> </span><u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Aug 26, 2024 at 10:48<span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span>AM John P. Rudy via LCTG <<a href="mailto:lctg@lists.toku.us" target="_blank">lctg@lists.toku.us</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style="border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt"><div><div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">I have an old refrigerator. The circuit breaker has tripped 3 times today. Any suggestions?</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">I know I can buy a new refrigerator</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif"> </span><u></u><u></u></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">John</span><u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal">===============================================<br>::The Lexington Computer and Technology Group Mailing List::<br>Reply goes to sender only; Reply All to send to list.<br>Send to the list: <a href="mailto:LCTG@lists.toku.us" target="_blank">LCTG@lists.toku.us</a> Message archives: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/pipermail/lctg-toku.us/" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/pipermail/lctg-toku.us/</a><br>To subscribe: email <a href="mailto:lctg-subscribe@toku.us" target="_blank">lctg-subscribe@toku.us</a> To unsubscribe: email <a href="mailto:lctg-unsubscribe@toku.us" target="_blank">lctg-unsubscribe@toku.us</a><br>Future and Past meeting information: <a href="http://LCTG.toku.us" target="_blank">http://LCTG.toku.us</a><br>List information: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/listinfo.cgi/lctg-toku.us" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/listinfo.cgi/lctg-toku.us</a><br>This message was sent to <a href="mailto:s%2Blctglist@smistuff.com" target="_blank">s+lctglist@smistuff.com</a>.<br>Set your list options: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/options.cgi/lctg-toku.us/s+lctglist@smistuff.com" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/options.cgi/lctg-toku.us/s+lctglist@smistuff.com</a><u></u><u></u></p></div></blockquote></div><p class="MsoNormal"><br><br><br><u></u><u></u></p><pre>===============================================<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>::The Lexington Computer and Technology Group Mailing List::<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Reply goes to sender only; Reply All to send to list.<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Send to the list: <a href="mailto:LCTG@lists.toku.us" target="_blank">LCTG@lists.toku.us</a> Message archives: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/pipermail/lctg-toku.us/" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/pipermail/lctg-toku.us/</a><u></u><u></u></pre><pre>To subscribe: email <a href="mailto:lctg-subscribe@toku.us" target="_blank">lctg-subscribe@toku.us</a> To unsubscribe: email <a href="mailto:lctg-unsubscribe@toku.us" target="_blank">lctg-unsubscribe@toku.us</a><u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Future and Past meeting information: <a href="http://LCTG.toku.us" target="_blank">http://LCTG.toku.us</a><u></u><u></u></pre><pre>List information: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/listinfo.cgi/lctg-toku.us" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/listinfo.cgi/lctg-toku.us</a><u></u><u></u></pre><pre>This message was sent to <a href="mailto:pogran@alum.mit.edu" target="_blank">pogran@alum.mit.edu</a>.<u></u><u></u></pre><pre>Set your list options: <a href="http://lists.toku.us/options.cgi/lctg-toku.us/pogran@alum.mit.edu" target="_blank">http://lists.toku.us/options.cgi/lctg-toku.us/pogran@alum.mit.edu</a><u></u><u></u></pre></blockquote><p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p></div></div>===============================================<br>
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