[Lex Computer & Tech Group/LCTG] Nuclear fusion...

Tue Dec 13 09:34:47 PST 2022

All,

The HYPE is so so outpacing reality that even respected scientists [albeit
Laser-related for the most part] are making statements such as:
"This is the first time on Earth that Fusion has released more Energy than
it took to ignite the reaction] --- ABSOLUTELY FALSE -- ref an experiment
conducted in the middle of the Pacific on an island since removed from the
map
The experiment used liquid Deuterium as the fuel with a trigger being a
fission device [about the same yield as the WWII era devices [10 - 20 kTons]
Ivy Mike
Time: 19:14:59.4 31 October 1952 (GMT)
07:14:59.4 1 November 1952 (local)
Location: Elugelab ("Flora") Island, Enewetak Atoll
Test Height and Type: Surface burst
Yield: 10.4 Mt

By the LLNL PR process the Q was about 1000 [OK perhaps you only can
consider the pure fusion part of the yield which of about 2.4 megatons
coming directly from fusion of the deuterium fuel] -- the rest of the
"fusion component" was actually due to the fast neutron fission of the
Uranium Tamper surrounding the fusion care

see https://nuclearweaponarchive.org/Usa/Tests/Ivy.html

The device detonated in the Mike ("m" for "megaton") test, called the
> Sausage, was the first "true" H-Bomb ever tested, that is - the first
> thermonuclear device built upon the Teller-Ulam principles of staged
> radiation implosion. The device was designed by the Panda Committee
> directed by J. Carson Mark at Los Alamos (Teller declined to play a role in
> its development).

The 10.4 megaton device was a two stage device using a TX-5 fission bomb as
> the primary stage, and a secondary stage consisting of liquid deuterium
> fusion fuel stored in a cylindrical Dewar (thermos) flask. Running down the
> center of the Dewar was a plutonium "spark plug" rod to ignite the fusion
> reaction. The Dewar was surrounded by a natural uranium pusher/tamper
> weighing more than 5 metric tons. The entire assembly was housed in an
> enormous steel casing, 80 inches wide and 244 inches long, with walls
> ~10-12 inches thick, the largest single forging made up to that time. The
> inside surface of the casing was lined with sheets of lead and polyethylene
> to form the radiation channel that conducted heat from the primary to the
> secondary. The entire device weighed 82 tons.

The enormous explosion was the 4th largest device ever tested by the U.S.
> 77% (8 megatons) of the yield was due to fast fission of the natural
> uranium pusher/tamper, with remainder (2.4 megatons) coming directly from
> fusion of the deuterium fuel. The island the test device was installed on,
> Elugelab (code named Flora), was entirely destroyed. The resulting crater
> was 6240 ft across and 164 ft deep. High levels of radiation blanketed much
> of the atoll following the test.

The main  differences between "Ivey Mike" and the NIF PR were
 scale and
substituting the X-rays produced by the 192 Laser beams converging on the
"fusion capsule" for the x-rays produced by the explosion of the TX-5
fission bomb using the Teller-UIam radiation comopression model of Inertial
Confinement Fusion

Oh and you don't have to replace the island after the test

Ted

On Mon, Dec 12, 2022 at 10:01 PM Marvin Menzin <mmenzin at icloud.com> wrote:

> Engineers ,scientists , inventors are all  optimists. if they weren't they
> would not try to achieve new and better things ..and risk failures…
> so experienced business mgrs know not to trust their cost and time
> estimates..
>
> the bigger the challenge  the bigger the underestimates of cost and time
> to complete
> so its no surprise efficient fusion is still far off.  no reflection on
> the guys trying to do fusion … just a fact of life managers have to live
> with.
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Dec 12, 2022, at 9:47 PM, George Gamota <ggamota at stma-llc.com> wrote:
>
> 
>
> I have a story to tell. I was at the University of Michigan when I met Kip
> Siegal before he founded KMS Fusion. Then later in my career, while a
> professor at UM, I met the new CEO whose main goal was to sue the
> government for breach of contract for developing commercial fusion. Some of
> the key people involved were our neighbors, and we often discussed the
> chances of commercial fusion. They all said 50 years hence. That was in
> 1985.
>
> Kip was visionary and very bright, but his salesmanship was ahead of
> reality. He died in 1975 while testifying in Congress, promising fusion
> around the corner – just one more experiment and a million or so dollars
> needed…
>
> Sad story.
>
> George
>
>
>
> *From:* LCTG <lctg-bounces+ggamota=stma-llc.com at lists.toku.us> *On Behalf
> Of *Michael Alexander
> *Sent:* Monday, December 12, 2022 6:02 PM
> *To:* Lex Computer Group <lctg at lists.toku.us>; Drew King (
> dking65 at kingconsulting.us) <dking65 at kingconsulting.us>
> *Subject:* Re: [Lex Computer & Tech Group/LCTG] Nuclear fusion...
>
>
>
> I will be interested to learn what Lawrence Livermore National Lab (LLNL)
> and Department of Energy (DOE) people have to say about this "scientific
> breakthrough".  Undoubtedly it's a tremendous technical achievement, but
> right now I have reservations.
>
>
>
> As I've understood the LLNL project, it's based on suddenly compressing a
> pellet of fusible -- hydrogen-containing, with tailored proportions of
> deuterium and tritium -- material.  To accomplish the compression, LLNL has
> constructed an array of synchronized high power lasers.  The pellet is
> dropped into the spot where the laser beams intersect; when the pellet
> reaches that spot, the lasers fire, compressing the pellet to achieve the
> conditions for fusion (light carries momentum).  I presume that, in order
> to create actual power generation, pellets will be dropped, one after the
> other, with lasers repetitively firing.
>
>
>
> This is a super-complicated scheme, which makes me wonder whether it can
> be used to produce energy continuously and reliably over months and years
> (assuming the energy can be extracted reliably and continuously).
> Moreover, I wonder how many such installations power companies would build
> and install, and whether they will develop the technical competence to run
> them.  It will be interesting.
>
>
>
> As a language purist of sorts, by the way, I object to the achievement
> being touted as a *scientific* breakthrough: It is an engineering
> breakthrough.
>
>
>
>     -- Mike Alexander
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Monday, December 12, 2022 at 05:29:53 PM EST, Drew King (
> dking65 at kingconsulting.us) <dking65 at kingconsulting.us> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> All,
>
> The Verge: A “scientific breakthrough” in nuclear fusion? How to watch the
> announcement tomorrow.
>
> https://www.theverge.com/2022/12/12/23505416/nuclear-fusion-scientific-breakthrough-how-to-watch-announcement-biden
>
> --
> Drew King
>
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